- [Narrator] Funding for this edition of One-On-One with Steve Adubato has been provided by University Hospital.

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- This is One-On-One.

- I'm an equal American just like you are.

- The jobs of tomorrow are not the jobs of yesterday.

- Look at this.

You get this?

- Life without dance is boring.

- I don't care how good you are or how good you think you are, there is always something to learn.

- I did do the finale, and guess where my trailer was?

A block away from my apartment, it couldn't have been better!

- People call me 'cause they feel nobody's paying attention.

- (slowly) Start talking right now.

- That's a good question, high five.

(upbeat music) (pop music) ♪ Better than all the rest ♪ ♪ oh, better than anyone ♪ ♪ anyone, I've ever met ♪ ♪ ooh, I'm stuck on your heart ♪ ♪ I hang on every word you say ♪ - Hi folks, I'm Steve Adubato.

One of the great things about this show, and we look forward to getting back into the WNET, Tisch Lincoln Center studio, 'Cause it's right around Broadway.

But even if it's remote, we're bringing you Broadway.

It's toward the end of 2021, there's some great shows and one of them is Tina, The Tina Turner Musical, and we're honored to have Dawnn Lewis, who is in Tina.

She plays Zelma Bullock, who is Tina's mom, correct?

- Yes, absolutely correct.

- First of all, we're honored to have you and thank you for joining us on public broadcasting.

- My absolute pleasure, I grew up on PBS, I love PBS.

My introduction to PBS was like the children's television workshop, way back in the day with Sesame Street.

- There it is.

- Yeah, I was in the third grade and got to do a little guest appearance on Sesame Street with Jim Henson, and the Muppets, - You were on, - Well, it wasn't technically the show.

They came and did a presentation at my public school, PS 9 in Brooklyn, New York.

And yes, so I got to meet Jim Henson, and work with some of the Muppets, and I played cello at the time, it was, it was fantastic.

It was an awesome experience.

And PBS has been a part of my life ever since.

So I'm grateful for all the programming, the amazing programming, that you guys commit yourself to doing.

- Yeah, our colleagues do important work.

Hey, let me ask you this Dawnn, for those who again, The Tina Turner Musical, a great musical, a powerful story.

You relate to Tina Turner's story on so many levels.

You talk about growing up in Brooklyn.

Your dad was a police officer if I'm not mistaken, - Yes he was.

- but you grew up and you've told our producers, and you've said this publicly, you've been an advocate of protecting those who are victims of violence, domestic violence.

You grew up in a home, where you said your dad, while he was a cop and a hero in the, in the neighborhood, if you will, it was an abusive home.

- It was an abusive home.

You know, that was a very challenging time for people of color here in this country.

Well, it's been a challenging time for people of color for generations, but particularly in the sixties, coming up were civil rights activism and people really becoming more outspoken about their place in the world.

We were just very challenged with being empowered, seemingly in one area, while feeling powerless for completely other reasons.

And I can't speak for what was exactly in my dad's mind, at the time, but to your point on one hand, he was this amazing hero, serving the community, but at home, his frustrations, his anxieties, his whatever it was, was taken out on my mom and my brothers, and myself.

So coming up, my mom finally got to a point where she felt like she had to save herself, and in order to save herself, and ultimately save her kids, she left us and we didn't see our mom for about a year and a half.

Very much like Zelma Bullock.

She was in a home with domestic violence.

The, her husband was the pastor in the community.

So he was a community leader.

So in the community, he was one thing, but at home, he was something very different.

So the thought of leaving your children behind today to save yourself, a lot of people wouldn't agree with that.

But at the time, that's what was the reality, for women in this country, and not just women of color, but women in general, being a very patriarchal society.

So, yeah, I relate wholeheartedly and because of my mom, I'm the person that I am today, because of my brothers.

We learnt to not only survive, but thrive through a very, very dangerous upbringing and grace of God, before he passed, my dad learned to be a better person, you know, and change his ways and change his life.

So I'm grateful for that.

- Hey, mom, don't be offended, my mom who watches every night, on One on One, but to my sisters, myself, I can understand and appreciate a fair amount of what you just shared.

I'm just gonna leave it at that.

Growing up in Newark, New Jersey, and I understand.

To a degree.

That being said, how hard is it?

- Steve?

Just real quick.

What helps in us telling these stories, and telling stories like Tina, is that it lets other people know it's not just them.

And it's nothing to be ashamed of.

And especially if you're a kid, it's not your fault.

Do you know what I mean?

And when you hear us, like us, in our positions, what we've accomplished today, be able to share that honestly, it not only heals us, but it heals others as well.

That's my hope.

- But how hard... - I'm sorry for interrupting Dawnn, but how hard is it for you, to have lived, what you've lived, to share, what you just shared is what it is, then to play the role that you play in Tina, The Tina Turner Musical, knowing what you know about Tina Turner, playing her mom here.

Is it hard for you on a human personal level, or do you somehow separate, your life, your experience, your life experiences from your work as an artist?

- You know what?

I don't really separate it.

I use it to empower me.

I have nothing but respect and honor for my mom.

and again, like I said, by today's standards, you may consider my mom or Zelma a villain, and they're not.

They are brave women, who survived, and did what they could to help their kids.

So I try to bring that kind of humanity to Zelma.

Yes, she was a challenged human being for a lot of reasons.

And her and Tina's relationship was very challenged, right to the end, for a lot of reasons.

But these are human beings, so I try to bring that element of, of humanity and understanding to Zelma.

So, no, I don't shy away from it at all.

I embrace it and use it to fuel me, show after show.

- I did not share this in the beginning.

I'll share it now.

Dawnn Lewis is also a Grammy award-winning singer.

So you recognize her for a lot of reasons, but one of them is she starred in the 1990 sitcom A Different World.

I mean, what a show, right?

But you also wrote the theme song for that show.

- I did.

- When did you know, that you had a gift from above, to have this extraordinary voice?

When did you know?

- Four years old.

- Four?

- I sang my, four years old, four years old.

I sang my very first concert, and I actually bombed because I was so scared on stage.

I was phenomenal in rehearsals, and once I got in stage in front of the audience, I was so terrified, I got through the song, and vowed I would never be that scared again, and then just a couple of years later, while I was in elementary school, I got the Sesame Street opportunity, and person after person, praise God for public school teachers.

It's a thankless job.

It's a difficult job, but what they are able to speak into the lives of encouragement of kids, growing up in Bed-Stuy, Brooklyn, again, knowing now some of my backstory of what my home environment was, there was a lot going on, and I was bullied.

So from the time I was young, it was spoken in, in to me, that I possess something special and to try my best to tune out all the negative, destructive things and focus on the things that made me special, including my name, which I always hated.

- Really?

- I never liked my name because all my friends, - Dawnn?

- Dawnn, I thought it was so simple.

I thought it was so boring.

My friends had names like Michelle and Stephanie and Nicola.

And I was like, Dawnn is boring, until my teachers explained to me, he says, but Dawnn, every day has a dawn.

You are the beginning, the first light, the best thing about every day, you give everyday hope.

And I was like, wow, yeah, okay.

That's pretty cool.

And my name has two n's on it.

So I've learned to love and embrace my name, which is why I named my foundation, The A New Day Foundation.

It's a play on my name, Dawnn.

put up The New Day Foundation website.

Tell us what it is, Dawnn, please.

- The A New Day Foundation, is a nonprofit organization, that I started several years ago, where we give hope and empowerment, as well as, financial and programmatic support to underserved youth and communities, here in the U.S. as well as abroad.

We've taken programs as far away as India and South America, where my family is from, Guyana.

- Wow.

Hey before I let you go, I'm looking forward to, as I said, with my wife, to come and see, come and see Tina, The Tina Turner musical, where is it?

Let everyone know.

- We are at the Lunt-Fontanne Theater, on 46th street, right across the street from Hamilton, across the street from Ain't Too Proud To Beg.

So while you're down watching Broadway shows, come on and check us out, and remember, no matter what you see me do on stage, I'm the nice one!

(laughing) (clapping) - Hey, real quick.

It's it, we're toward the end of 2021.

What does it mean to you, personally, to be performing live, on Broadway, after what all of us, particularly you and your colleagues have gone through in this pandemic?

What does it mean to be out there, and to see that audience?

- There's nothing better than a live performance, a live audience being in the moment, each show, even if you've seen it before, brings something different every night.

I'm so proud of our Broadway community, how they are doing everything in their utmost, to be safe on stage, with all of our COVID protocols, with regular testing, wearing masks, when we're not on stage.

Our audiences come, and they respect the environment, and they too are committed to wearing masks during the performance.

It's not comfortable.

It's not usual, but it's where we are right now.

And so being able to come back together, and find a way to do it safely, just means the world because we cannot survive without the arts, especially the live arts.

- That's Dawnn Lewis, she plays Zelma Bullock in Tina, The Tina Turner Musical.

She's a Grammy award-winning singer at the Lunt-Fontanne Theater.

I can't thank you enough.

You honor us on public broadcasting by joining us.

All the best to you and your family and the cast.

Thank you, Dawnn.

- Thank you.

Can I say one quick thing?

In addition to the Grammy, this year, I was also inducted into the Women Songwriters Hall of Fame, in Washington, DC.

(clapping) - Thank you, alongside Roberta Flack, Valerie Simpson, Naomi Judd.

I mean, it was just, it was.

- Wow, a bunch of under achievers.

(laughing) - A bunch of under achievers and yes, yes, yes.

- That's awesome.

Congratulations Dawnn.

- Thank you.

Thank you so much.

- Well deserved.

Thanks so much.

- Take care.

Bye Steve.

- You got it.

I'm Steve Adubato, more importantly, that's Dawnn Lewis.

Be right back after this.

- [Narrator] To watch more One on One with Steve Adubato find us online and follow us on Social media.

- We are absolutely honored to be joined by an icon on so many levels: in the music industry, entertainment, acting.

He is Stevie Van Zandt: musician, author, actor.

He's the author of this book, "Unrequited Infatuations."

So good to have you with us, and we are being joined, is that Edie?

- That's Edie.

She's temporarily with us at the moment.

We'll see how long she lasts here, but I'll try putting her down.

We'll see, we'll see.

Hang on.

- Don't worry about it.

Whatever happens, happens.

- Yeah, sometimes she cooperates.

(laughing) Sometimes she doesn't.

- She's like a lot of dogs and people I know, like our dog Pete.

Ours is Petey, but I'll go, you know.

Listen, let's do this: I have to tell you that, along with so many others, I'm a Jersey guy.

You are 'the' Jersey guy along with your friend Bruce.

You've entertained.

You've given so much to so many for so long in this state and this nation and the world.

Your gift for music and creativity comes from where, Stevie?

- Oh, I have no idea.

You know, I guess it must be some kinda DNA.

The only person I can think of that had any kind of, you know, show biz in them at all was my grandmother Nana Lento.

She was always the life of the party, but you know, no real direct, you know.

My father supposedly, well, he's my stepfather, so there's no blood connection there, but he supposedly played trumpet when he was young, but he never played trumpet around the house, and so there's no real, there's no real obvious musical connection.

It's a strange thing, actually.

You know, I don't know.

- However it happens, you begin to realize early on that you have a love of music, and by the way, can we plug, Stevie, if we could, on Sirius, what can people find on Sirius?

We'll talk about the E Street Brand and Bruce and "The Sopranos" and all that, but Sirius, I love you on Sirius.

Tell everyone what and where.

- Yeah, I brought the first two original formats to Sirius Satellite, she's almost 20 years ago now.

My rock and roll station, Underground Garage, is 21, and my Outlaw Country station is channel 60, and they both kinda have the same idea, which is playing music that most formats don't play anymore that I consider to be the best music ever made, so they're both from a period I refer to as the Renaissance.

It's mostly '50s, '60s, and '70s, but we play right up until, you know, we play new bands also, and in fact, we've introduced over a thousand new bands in 20 years, yeah, so people are still putting together rock and roll bands even though there's no logical reason to do it, you know.

There's no real reward anymore, and it makes me wanna support them, you know, all the more because they're doing it strictly outta passion at this point, you know, 'cause you know, it's no longer part of the mainstream industry, and you know, we're back to being a cult, let's face it.

- Well, Stevie, let's go back a few years 'cause I wanna talk about politics and "Sun City" and your passion for being supportive of those who are struggling and suffering, and that, you've just done so much in that regard, but I wanna ask you: just get this part outta the way.

I did hear you on other shows talking about this, but when you left the E Street Band, your relationship with Bruce complex, close, personal, a whole bunch of things, you said it was a big mistake.

- Well, I've always referred to it as the biggest mistake of my life, but going back and doing the book really helped really put it in perspective.

When you go back and really analyze it, it turns out that everything I've done in my life, I've done since I left the E Street Band, you know, so it, you know, it seemed like a mistake at the time, and it was, you know, a financial mistake, but money isn't everything.

(laughs) My book certainly proves that.

If anything, my story is the triumph of art over commerce, you know.

- Why do you say that, Stevie?

Why do you say that?

Art over commerce, why do you say that?

- Well, because my own personal work has never found an audience, you know, and that's, you know, the unrequited infatuations of my life along with the great successes, which I've had, you know, with the E Street Band, with "The Sopranos" and "Lilyhammer" and the "Sun City" project, an extremely successful political story, but my own most personal work has never really found an audience, and that's, you know, it's a little bit frustrating and disappointing, but I think the usefulness of the book, I hope, really is the second half of the book, when I leave the E Street Band, and the first half of the book is a great story, you know, local kid from Jersey makes it to the top of rock and roll.

Terrific story, you know, and I don't mean to sound ungrateful about that, but the second half, you know, starts to become a little bit more universal and I think, you know, becomes more than a music book for music people.

I think it's a little bit more general and starts to talk about, you know, seeking a purpose in life, and a usefulness, and one's identity, and even searching for spiritual enlightenment, and I think that's more universal, and you start to realize, you know, even though I didn't have a plan, I didn't really change jobs.

I mean, my life ended, and I had to start from scratch.

- I'm sorry for interrupting, Stevie.

When you left the E Street Band, you had to, quote, start from scratch.

- Yes, I mean, there was no plan.

My only plan in life was to make it in rock and roll.

That was it.

That was the first, you know, that was my entire plan of life, and I made it, and I walked away from it, and suddenly I'm looking, staring into the abyss.

I'm in the wasteland, man, you know, and so I, you know, and I think there's something there to maybe be, you know, a universal truth that people can hopefully be inspired by a little bit.

You know, when you think your life is over.

You know, maybe that first plan of your life doesn't work out.

Maybe you hit some kinda disappointment.

You know, if you can find a way to move forward, you don't let it stop you.

You don't get stopped by, you know, alcohol or drugs or, you know, commit suicide or any of those things that, you know, your first impulse may be, and all those things occurred to me.

If you can find a way to move forward, destiny has a way of finding something, you know, that you may be, you know, you'll be surprised by, you know.

It's not, destiny's not done with you yet.

You know, it's gonna find something for you to do, and in my case, it was everything, everything that I've done, you know.

- Including Silvio Dante.

I'm sorry for interrupting, Stevie.

Including David Chase, Jersey guy.

I believe the Caldwell, Clifton, somewhere.

You didn't wanna be an actor.

You didn't wanna be in front of the camera, and all of a sudden, you're Silvio Dante, and I think you said to him, I think, in the book, you didn't wanna take an actor's job, and he said, "Fine, I'll create something that wasn't for any other actor.

I'll create it for you."

Is that a fair assessment?

- No, that's true, that's true.

You know, 'cause I watched, I watched my wife, who's a real actor, I watched what she goes through, you know, going to classes year after year and off Broadway, off-off Broadway.

I was, like, "I shouldn't take an actor's job," and he says, "Okay, I'll write you in a part, then," you know.

- And that's Silvio Dante?

- Yeah, that ended up being Silvio Dante, and you know, and that was, that's how that happened.

I mean, it sounds like a crazy Hollywood story, but that's what happened, you know.

- Let me ask you this.

There are these two powerful figures, so many people in your life, so many people you've influenced, and I do wanna get to "Sun City," but there's James Gandolfini, and by the way, six of your castmates, we've actually interviewed so far, and so it's an honor to have you with us, and I've asked each one of them about James Gandolfini, but the Gandolfini relationship and the Springsteen relationship, similar in any ways, dramatically different?

You help us understand, 'cause two giants.

- Well, I mean, what happened was my real life ended up being a model for the fictional characters.

You know, when I started off, I just was, my character was running the strip club for the family.

- The Bada Bing.

- Yeah, yeah, the Bada Bing.

- I just wanted to say that.

(both laughing) I just had to say that to you.

I'm sorry.

Go ahead.

- (laughs) But the role wasn't exactly well-defined because, you know, we had just made it up, right?

And what's interesting to me, and I don't even think this is in the book, actually, which I, you know, I'll have to put it in for the next edition 'cause it just occurred to me.

As detailed as David Chase was and is, and as thorough, and you know, all about authenticity, he did not write in the underboss role or the consigliere.

You know, now sometimes, there's two different guys in, you know, two different roles in a mob family.

Sometimes it's the same guy.

You know, sometimes the underboss is the consigliere.

Sometimes they're two different guys.

He didn't write those parts in.

Now, isn't that fascinating?

You know, because here I come in, and it's uncertain kinda what my role is.

I think he picks up on the fact that me and Jimmy start bonding off-screen, mostly because I think we're both character actors.

You know, he's a character actor.

I'm a side man.

We both kind of feel more comfortable a little bit, you know, outta the spotlight, you know, but we both had to rise to the occasion when we were asked to, and I think we kinda bonded on that basis of neither one of us, you know, really needing that spotlight.

Maybe David Chase picked up on that, I don't know, but by the end of the first season, maybe end of the second season, I suddenly, my character becomes that underboss/consigliere, and it wasn't really written in, you know, but it ended up being the same role that I had been playing with Bruce Springsteen in real life, you know, my whole life, so I knew exactly how to do that.

- But Stevie, go back for a second.

Again, I wish we had two hours, even though you don't have that time, but so Bruce clearly out front.

A performer, I'm not gonna say wants or needs the attention 'cause who am I to say that, but was very comfortable with it.

You were very comfortable being right there with him but not being the guy?

I hate to put it that way, Stevie.

- Yes, no, no, no, no, that's correct.

You know, I like being the guy behind the guy.

You know, I do.

In fact, if I had to describe myself, it would be as a writer/producer.

The performance part of my life is the fun part, to be honest.

I mean, it's a wonderful job, or wonderful two jobs, being, you know, a rock guy and an actor, but it's the fun part of life.

It's not my most satisfying, you know, part of my, you know, realizing my own potential, let's put it that way.

You know, I feel that has to be the creative process is what I get off on, you know.

The performance part, which is the part that people see, so that's all they really know, you know, it's important, and it's a wonderful job, making people happy, entertaining them and inspiring them, motivating them.

That's all great, but it's fun.

It's a vacation for me.

You know, that's not the work.

The work is the creative stuff.

- You know, Stevie, I am not doing justice to this book.

Stevie Van Zandt, "Unrequited Infatuations."

I want you to go out and get this book, folks.

I feel like the Oprah Book Club, but not that I confuse myself with Oprah, but the politics, (Steven laughing) "Sun City," South Africa, apartheid, a commitment, an abiding, consistent commitment for many, many years, particular the second half of this book to finding meaning largely in helping others as well as, as Stevie said, his spiritual journey.

Get this book.

Stevie Van Zandt, you honor us by joining us on public broadcasting.

Wish you and your family all the best in everything you do moving forward, all good things.

Thank you, Stevie.

- Thank you, Steve.

Good seeing you.

- Same here.

I'm Steve Adubato.

Way more importantly, that's Stevie Van Zandt.

It's the interview I've been wanting to do for a long time.

We'll see you next time.

- [Narrator] One-On-One with Steve Adubato has been a production of the Caucus Educational Corporation.

Funding has been provided by University Hospital.

New Jersey Institute of Technology.

Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey.

The New Jersey Education Association.

The New Jersey Economic Development Authority.

PSE&G.

Johnson & Johnson.

Choose New Jersey.

And by Fedway Associates, Inc.

Promotional support provided by NJ.Com, And by New Jersey Monthly.

(gentle upbeat music) - [Miles] I'm Miles and this is what I work for, to be my best for them and for me, in body and in mind.

I need a health insurer that helps me get the care I need for both, that has mental health professionals that I can talk to when I need to.

Because when I feel strong and secure, so do they.

This is my life.

And this is how Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey works for me.